I just recieved my z3100 and set it up, but I've had problems on the 1st 3 prints I've tried.

No issues with setup. calibration or profiling, but the 1st 20x30 print I made on HM FAP started off OK but about 1/2 way showed some slight bands, then very muted colours and flat greys (birch trunks in deep shadow that had good mid to deep grey contrast).

I realised that I'd profiled using thick fine art > 250 as the paper type (realised this when I had no access to gloss enhancer), so I reprofiled using semigloss/satin photo paper and ran another print. This time the colours seemed good across the print, but I got what I think look like head strikes in 5 or 6 columns down the print. They appear as narrow striped white columns that fade in and out from 1/4 to 1/2" across, alternating white bands/stripes and print colour bands, about 1/16" or so thick.

I checked out the troubleshoting guide and couldn't find this specific problem, but I thought it was possible that I'd left the paper setting in the driver at photo gloss and it might be thinner, I printed the imbedded test pattern and saw no problems, so I tried to print a 9 x 22" section after carefully setting the paper type as satin/semigloss. I got the same problem again with the lines.

I saw no problems like this in either the calibraqtion or the profiling patterns (the latter run across the whole width of the roll).

Has anyone had this issue? Have you identified the problem snd fixed it?
What paper type do you set up Hahnemuhle Fine Art Pearl on the printer?
How about Hahnemuhle PR 308. I have a roll of this too and may try a print tomorrow depending on how things go with FAP.

Thanks,

Mike

Continued problems with no root cause or solution at present.

After a couple of additional short test prints (no more full size ones for the time being ) that repeated the problem I began to wonder if I may have a bad roll of 24" HM FAP, so I switched to a roll of Epson Premium Lustre that I'd used a few times on my Epson 4000. It's also thinner than the HM FAP.

Before I calibrated and profiled the Epson paper I used the troubleshooting guide to run through the HP solutions to fix banding (although this did not look like banding), they suggest a head clean, a head alignment, and a paper feed check. Unfortunately the head clean is done using the same special kind of wipes that come with the heads and are used when they are initially installed, so of corse mine had all been discarded and the printer comes with no spares. I reluctantly skipped the head clean step and ran the head align and paper feed check. No issues that I could see with the test prints made by those steps. So I tried the EPP Lustre.

No problems with the calibration or profile patterns (but I'd had none with the 24" HM FAP). A short test print looked OK, so I committed a 16x24....bad idea. This time I did not get the zebra stripe columns as I'm now officially calling them, but this time I got faint horizontal bands, pretty subtle as I didn't notice them until I got the print out and under some brighter lights In fact there appear to be 2 problems on this print, a repeating band about every inch or so, 1/8" wide and very slightly darker, and then a much more distinct dark band about 1 inch from the end of the print, this one about 1/4" but with less distinct edges.

I imagine I'll be talking to HP tomorrow.

Mike

I haven't experienced any of these problems, but as a stab in the dark, did you shake the carts before installing them? Are your ambient temp and humidity in the recommended range min 30%RH and 74F?

Hi Amadou,
Thanks for the suggestions. Yes, I did shake them, this is the same technique the Epson cartridges need and I've been using the 4000 for nearly 3 years now with no issues. My temp is definitely OK. I don't know the humidity but I'd expect that it pretty normal.

I signed onto the HP website looking for their support FAQ etc. Nothing there of any use, but I checked their z3100 forum and found less than a dozen posts, one of which described what sounds very much the zebra stripes on mine with the 24" HM FAP.

Could be a number of things.

One is air in the lines. Unlikely though as the calibration didn't show.
Two is the driver. On the 9180 some have said there are fine white lines when using the PS plug in on Windows only.

Head strikes show as gouges not density differences. Also highly unlikely if the calibration and profiles are fine.

I would try an advanced alignment. It's under some strange name in the printer diagnosis or print samples somewhere. I'd also see if the span of the head path is flat. The calibrations and profile charts are good so in this area it must be. Perhaps the other side is out of whack.
HP will have more info on what to do, on this I'm sure.

Hi Neil,

Same problem here. I used Hahnemule FineArt Perl 13X19. The weird thing is, it will print fine if I feed paper vertically and produce "zebra" lines described by Mike if place paper horizontally.

After careful observation I concluded that part of the print head carriage is striking paper and physically stripping part of the emulsion.

Weight of the paper is 285gsm, way bellow 500gsm limit.
I profile this paper under Photo Semigloss group.

Had no problem printing on much thicker paper profiled under Fine Art Papers group.

On top of that I started to loose some of my pizza wheels.

And can any body enlighten me why HP driver is not acting correct when you change between landscape and portrait mode? I have to rotate my image in Photoshop to be able to print it correct.

Andre Aloshine

Hi Andre,
I just spent some time on the phone with HP support.
I had to add an extension to my USB cable as my 16' cable is not long enough (the z3100 connection is on the far left of the printer, in quite a different place to my Epson 4000). They suggested that as the profiles look fine but the prints look bad this could be a communication problem. They also agreed with Neil's comment that a head strike would scuff the ink, while the marks on my FAP prints are dead white. The file I sent to the printer using Epsom Premium Lustre was a good bit smaller.
Are you using USB, and are you using a long cable?
Are you getting the marks on your profile patterns, or just your prints?
Can you describe what you mean by "losing pizza wheels" please? I did ask how the paper is held flat and was told that the HP has no vaccuum like the Epsons. The support tech told me that it uses star wheels to hold the paper flat. I assume this is what you mean. Are they breaking off?
I'll be trying to print from my laptop tonight using the same test files and also from CS2, the same as my desktop, but only a 3 foot USB.

By the way, I think landscape/portrait only refers to the orientation of your image, not the paper. The printer expects to see sheet paper loaded on the short side. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong, but every printer I've used does the same.

Hi Mike,

I'm using 3 feet cord. In my case HP guys can't blame this on communications problems.

In regard to Neils comment: it does make scuff marks (at list in my case).
To illustrate this I attached sample file. It is clearly physical contact of sharp and very thin part of the carriage with paper.

Star wheels= pizza wheels.
Yes they are braking out. It is known problem and HP is working to fix that.

In regards of Portrait- Landscape orientation, it looks like HP released half-cooked driver. It doesn't behave normally. It is complicated to
explain but you will recognize this when you will try to print your horizontally oriented images.

Cheers,

Andre

P.S. HP set me up with printer technician. I will let you know results of the visit.

Hi Andre,
Thanks for posting the sample pic, it looks very much like mine. I'll check my cable of course but this doesn't look good, I had some hopes that it might be a simple fix.

I've sent both landscape and portrait images to the paper I've been printing on with no issues, but I've only printed on rolls so far.

One question, is there a minimum size ? I mean do the prints have to be bigger than A4 ? A3 ? A2 or A1 to see the problem, or is it also visible in smaller prints ?

Hi Make,

Try to print 13X19 horizontal(landscape) on vertical paper 13w by 19h

Good luck

Andre

I was making a few enquiries about this printer, and the rep advised me before I gave it consideration - (as he knew I was an artist) , that the printer works best with paper up to 250 gsm, marginal between 250 and 300gsm, and not to consider papers above 300gsm because of 'fine lines appearing on the print - like zebra lines."

Interesting that he used the same terms you have. I have not seen any prints, nor the machine, so I cannot be certain, but it sounds like someone in HP knows there is a bit of a problem, or their machine is doing the same thing.

Julie

Now I really don't think HP will be that stupid. Ok lets first look what comes out, but a printer only working good till 250 is a joke. My Printer would be faster gone before it was here ;-)

Some more problems.

After installing new firmware 4.0.0.6 and new drivers from HP website as suggested by tech support rep, printer does not calibrate any more. System Error message 58:10.

"The printer's color sensor is not working well. Color reading operation may fail. If the problem persists,call HP."

So much for improved firmware functionality.

So far this printer lives up to its over hyped marketing massage. It is very consistent in its inconsistency.

Cheers,

Andre

Sorry to hear that. I wanted to install the firmware right now. Now I'm not so sure anymore if I really should do it :-(

I already run the 3100 on the new firmware 4.0.0.6 from the HP website, no problems up to print size 1,30m x 0,60m.

I work on Mac G5 10.4 - from Photoshop via Ethernet.

No reason not to install the Firmware from my point...
Best,

Clem

Chris, I don't know if the problem appears on smaller prints, I only have 17 and 24" rolls.

Andre, for the same reason I can't print on any cut paper, but yesterday on 17 Epson Premium Lustre I had regular banding but not the zebra stripes.

I have just tried a print with the supplied HP USB cable from my laptop and I got one faint mark, so this does not seem to be the solution. The fact that it's only one instead of 5 or 6 is not much of a surprise as yesterday I was getting only 2 columns on some tests. I'm printing another as I type.

I took a photo of an area from one of yesterday's just to show how similar it is to your problem Andre. The interesting thing here is that in the dark area between the top and bottom sections you can see that there is colour amid the faint scuffs, so I'm confident now with your and Neils's comments that it's a head strike.

Oh well, the next test came off and it's got 2 very obvious columns.

Andre, thanks for the warning about the firmaware update.

Julie,
Thanks for mentioning this, it is clearly a know issue and very depressing if they know of this susceptibility..

Ok just a short note:

I know printed a 13*19 photo with HM Photo Rag 306. I had no problems at all, but first of all it was fed from a roll and it wasn't so big. Know I really would like to test it but right now I don't have anything larger than the 13*19 expect the Glossy Paper HP supplied, but we all know that there is no problem.

Did Someone tried to print on Rolls with 13*19 or does someone has any marks on a 13*19 sheets ? I have some laying around. ( Innova F-Type, which is could be close to HM FAP )

If you also have the marks on 13*19 prints, than I will check it with a sheet or two.

Well it looks like Julie's rep knew what he was talking about.

After my last post I called HP tech support again. I got a different guy this time.

After re-reading the information in my case he made the following comments during our conversation. They are quoted pretty close to verbatim as I wrote them down after I hung up.

"Yes, I know what this is, it's the print heads scuffing the paper.
I can reproduce this here.
It only happens on Hahnemuhle right?
It only happens with thicker media.
It is due to the paper curl and stiffness.
We have only known about this for about a week.
Engineering are working on it but don't currently have a solution."

He suggested a work around of uncurling the paper and feeding cut sheets, but that's not acceptable to me as I only want to use 24" rolls with this printer. He also said that it may not work every time. The curl and the stiffness of the paper are key, the paper lifts up off the bed (?) after it's fed in as it's got such a strong curl. He said you can see it if you lift the cover and shine a light inside. I haven't done this to confirm it, but without vacuum to hold the paper I can believe it.

I asked how I should return the printer and he said to go through my supplier and if I had trouble to use my case number. I'm pretty sure it's going back, although I may give HP Engineering a week to see what they come up with. I will obviously be making no more test prints, long or short, it's cost me enough as it is.

My concerns if I keep it are as follows;
1) This seems like a re-engineer of the system used to flatten the paper. How well can this be retrofitted in the field, if at all?
2) How robust will any fix be? The curl is going to get worse at the end of a roll of paper. What about other papers, now and in the future? Will they test them all? Will it work now and then need another modification for a future generation paper?

I do wonder if this problem is more likely to happen on 24" rolls than 17". Perhaps someone will test this out. Given Christopher's comment that HM Photo Rag 308 was OK printed 13x19 I wonder if it's a peculiarity of FAP, or 24" rolls, or some interaction.

Just to keep all of the pertinent information in this string I will take photos of the problem I ran into on my 1st print when I mistakenly profiles using Fine Art > 250 paper type. This did not have the zebra stripes, but the greys lost definition towards the end of the print, as though I had lost a dark grey or black.

Lastly for Michael, perhaps you could make inquiries with HP about this issue. It is clearly a recent problem, but I (and others that are affected I'm sure) need to know soon what, if any, kind of engineering fix may be possible.

Thanks

First the firmware 4.0.6 is okay on all the beta printers I know of. On mine it works fine as far as feed goes, and all calibrations etc. There are some small bugs that have been relayed but nothing to do with what is in this thread.

I have or had two rolls of Hahnemuhle Photo Rag 308 here. I had no problems with printing with the 4.0.6 firmware on a Mac. I didn't try on the PC though. I only use Ethernet. If at all possible use Ethernet , as USB will never be as trouble free.

The media orientation can be a culprit , and has been with not only HP but the other makers too in some cases. I hope they can find and fix any discrepancies fast between these 2 orientation modes.

Paper thickness. A fine art printer made some tests on Arches Torchon non coated media which is over 500 g/m2 and double the recommended thickness. It printed without head strikes. It is also very rigid. Yet it is quite flat. Maybe it is the thick media that cockle (buckle or wave) under and or during printing with ink loads. This could be the major factor here. HP do and have fully tested their long time supplied media for the older 5500 . Yet if they can and have been able to repro the cockle on their machines then it wasn't happening to all media all the time.

It is simply not true about the media weights. Possibly the thickness if the problem in this thread perceives but weight is not restricted to less than 300 nor 250. My favourite media is the Satin Professional which is +300g/m2. Flawless. So I think it must be a set of conditions mostly around cockle which are image and environmental condition dependent.

Keep this thread alive, hope to hear HP respond with a viable solution quickly.

Sounds like HP got everything right except leaving off a vacuum.

Thanks for posting this info. as I was very close to purchasing this printer. The vast majority of my printing is done on 300 + gsm papers, so I'm holding off for now. Looks like I'm back to the Canon ipf5000, or 8000, or hopefully the ipf6000 will show up soon.

Sure HP will get the kinks worked out eventually. The obvious solution seems to be that a wide format printer should always have a vacuum.

"I only use Ethernet. If at all possible use Ethernet , as USB will never be as trouble free."

Neil:

I was having major issues with Ethernet on my Mac and the z (printing would stop in the middle of almost every print and then once printing resumed, it would only lay down the gloss ink and nothing else - covered the entire sheet with gloss ink - the cancel command would not work - wasted a lot of paper and gloss ink). HP support told me to only use USB. I moved the printer to my desktop so I could use USB and the problem has only happened once since then. Go figure.

"My favourite media is the Satin Professional which is +300g/m2. Flawless."

I've been waiting for this paper but HP still has none in stock to sell to mortals like the rest of us and they are now showing a month or more delivery date - do you have any idea when this might actually be in stock for sale to the public? From the samples I've seen it looks like a wonderful paper, I just wish they would sell it...

Tim Ernst in Arkansas

Neil, that is a very good point and does coincide with a couple of observations with the stripes I've had.

The stripes have always been worse (more stripes or more evident) on prints I've made which have heavy ink. The snapshot I posted earlier was the reflection off the ocean of a very early dark almost predawn clear sky, so it was very deep and dark blue/indigo. Laying down this much ink would change the stress of the paper a lot more than on an image with a lighter mix of busy detail, and in fact on 2 test prints I made of a Cape Cod pine forest, while I could see the marks they were much less evident.

One thing I could not understand was that towards the end of the print there was a dark band, about 3/8" deep or so (also shown in the snapshot). This was evident on all of the prints and test prints that had heavy ink. I realised that this again could be due to the paper stress change, but this time it would be because at the end of the print the rear heads stop putting ink on the paper abruptly at the trailing edge of the image, while the front heads continue to lay down ink. The clean edge of the paper continues to feed further into the printer and it will change the stress/buckle/wave characteristics of the whole section under the heads causing a different band as the print comes to the end.

For those people who have yet to experience this problem it might be worthwhile printing a full width dark print with little detail to see if you get even inking across the image (top to bottom).

Ok new or old problem ?

Ok I couldn't get the Zebra strips on my z3100, but that's pherhaps because I'm not using anything larger than 13in at the moment. ( A Pano around 13*30 on HM Photo Rag was fine.)

Now I tried some printing on Innova F-Type Gloss ( The glossy version ). I calibrated it and profiles it. Now I have some very strange strips on them. Even at A4 and on 13*19. It goes down all the way, but is only visible against the light. ( So it was kind of hard to photogrpah) They go from top to bottom. They run in print direction. So in a portrait picture from top to bottom. They are across the hole print. They are not always the same strength. They nearly look like roller marks. But that's strange ... I don't have anything like that on my Epson Glossy or on my HM Photo Rag prints..


I hope the Photos show what I mean.
Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment

Any one similar problem ?

EDIT: I even have them in the calibrtaion target.

Christopher,
In tests here last week I also found some print issues with the Innova FType Gloss. It definitely does not seem to be a good match for the Vivera pigments. I calibrated using the density aim points and ink loads triggered by the Photo Semigloss/Satin setting and get similar artifacts, but much less sever than in your example. The bigger issue is that on actual prints there is some mottling in shadow areas that is clearly visible at various print angles.

As always it's important to match the paper to the ink. Disappointing, but if that is the trade-off for the HP's greater longevity performance, I can live with choosing another paper. No issues so far on 3rd party matte papers and the HP branded papers, matte ang glossy look fine.

Yes I mean it doesn't bother me that much. It's a nice paper, but still not what I would like to have. I would never sell my photographs on this paper.

Wow, I have just ordered the 3100 44" and after reading this discussion I'm thinking of cancelling it. I print mostly on glossy media and Hanemule rag, but I also need to use Ethernet since my printer is 40' away (in the basement studio). My files are large, 300+mg. Am I asking for trouble using Ethernet and this printer? Not to mention I hadn't thought about the lack of a vacuum on this printer. This seems to be a problem with some papers.

Ok the following. I use a 15 meter Ethernet cable and have printed two over 500mb files with no problems. I also don't have any problems with HM Photo Rag so far. Also most real glossy papers work wonderful. ( Ilford Glossy, Epson Glossy, HM Glossy, and I LOVE the HP Glossy) Now The only problems I noticed som far is with Inova F-Type Gloss. Now there must be said, that I haven't printed larger than 13*19 yet. I first want to decide what paper I will use before buying expensive rolls.

I'm still not 100% sure, that these problems are typical for the z3100 series, or if only some very specific problems. Why ? First fo all the HP Forum is pretty clean only two or three posts about it. Here we also don't have many more posts. I know of people using it without any problems.

Now one question at Micheal:

Have you tried printing on larger rolls with Fine Art Paper ? Like HM FAP or More important Photo Rag 306 ?


One problem could be that the driver/printer has problems with heavy Glossy paper wich is profiles under glossy/pearl.

Edit: I have the 44 version.

Christopher,
Glad to hear your having success using Ethernet. I have been using the Epson Glossy and Innova F-Type gloss on the Epson 9800. Both look great, with the Epson being slightly warmer. The Innova has slightly better blacks I think. Will be interesting to print exact same prints on exact same papers on the HP 3100 now. How does the HP Glossy compare to these two papers?

What's still troubling, and I can't believe I didn't notice this before I ordered the printer is the lack of a vacuum. How can these printers handle the paper accurately without a vacuum? When I've used the Epson 9800, the vacuum, which is adjustable, sometimes makes the difference between having scuff lines and no lines on the print.

As I said, I don't have any problems yet, but I haven't printed so large. Now I have two prints sitting here from the M8 one printed on Epson and one on HP. It is really hard to tell. they look both close, but if I shut my eyes and stwitch them around ( And move them into diffrent light or position) than look again and guess wich one I like better I picked the HP 8 out of 10 times. Now as you know F-Type Gloss doesn't work, or at least not with my printer. The quality is nice, but there are all the ???"roller" marks??? over them. I don't have an x800 series printer but I still got my R2400 and compared to that I prefer the Gloss fom the Z in both prints. It looks more even more .... hm let's say better. (it would be easier to descrip it for me in German ;-) )

No the Vacuum is a thing, but I'm not sure if your really need it. A few things about that. IF these problems would be on many printers and papers, we would here much more about them. ALSO I think HP wouldn't make this kind of mistake. I still believe that they knew exactly what they did when leaving the Pump out. In really think the problem is software related. I can't proof it, because I don't have any larger rolls here but here is what I think:

The problems accure than the paper is profiled as Glossy or Pearl Paper. ( Which you would do with HM FAP to use the GLOP ) Mike first used the Fine Art paper setting and made a print. As I recall the print was absolutly fine. I mean no Strips or anything, just the bad colors and banding because of the wrong paper setting. NOW IF the poblem would be that the printer can't handle HM FAP in general, then shouldn't be the same strips in his first print ? I think that the paper you choose in the calibration mode changes the paper handling in general.


One more note, did you try to change the paper thickness in your color center ? I mean because all glossy are normaly calibrated as "normal", and Fine Art Papers like the HM Photo Rag is calibrated as "thick" medium. So did you try to change that setting ?

Ok that's all what I know so far, and as long as I don't have any larger paper I can't reproduce the strips. ( But sorry, but I won't by only for that purpose a HM FAP roll which I will never use again.)

Ok some more news from my side. Now I have actually tested my theory. As I said I got problems with F-Type Gloss and the Z3100 printer. Which gave me strange strips.
Now in the post above I said you should try to use the thick setting. I did that. I Used the thick option, and I was suprised. The makrs are still there, but nearly not visible. Now It's MUCH better. Still not good enough, for Fine Art, but if I compare it to the marks before, than it is a world apart. Before everyone noticed them on the first try. Now it is harder to see it.

I still think it's something cehmical which produces them. Some kind of reaction between the ink and the paper coating.

Could you post a link to the HP forum?

I don't have the z3100 yet, but I bid a pretty large print job and it looks like I'm going to get it, so I have to make a decision within a week, 10 days on a new printer. Not so crazy about that, because I would like to see what type of beast the canon ipf6000 turns out to be.

If the problem you are experiencing is limited to a few printers that may be out of whack, the z3100 is still an option for me. If media over 300 gsm can't be printed out consistently and reliably without these unacceptable marks on the print, I just don't have time for HP to try to solve the problem.

Thanks for the info.

Yes, on the 1st print I made I had profiled HM FAP as a "Fine Art > 250gsm" paper, not Photo Semigloss (I may have the names a little off, I'm not with the printer right now). I didn't get the zebra stripes on that print, and in fact the 1st 1/2 of the print looked great. The image I was printing is a little busy, but about 1/2 way though I saw some faint banding on a tree trunk, and by the end of the print all of the greys had gone flat, as though I had lost black. It was then that I reprofiled the HM FAP using the Photo semigloss paper type setting and ran into stripes. I think that when you choose FA paper > 250 setting it leaves a larger gap between the heads and the paper. This may for some reason be why the GE can't be used, I don't know, but it would make sense why there is less of an issue if that's the case. By the way the additional profile patterns and prints I made were fine for all colours, so clearly the black head is OK, so I have no idea why I got that strange effect.

I spoke one last time to HP Tech support yesterday. I wanted to see if they could give me some idea if we could expect a fix for this soon. Given that they have been able to reproduce this on their 3100's in the office they don't have to rely on the odd bad system in the field, so I was hoping for some relatively promising news, and if it was then I would make the call on keeping or returning the printer.

I spoke to a different guy than the last 2, however he was also aware of the problem, and had run tests himself and been able to demonstrate it. He made the following comments during our conversation;

"Probably a month or 2. This is a long term fix, there is no "quick fix" for this like a firware update.
Able to reproduce it on gloss media, not heavy weight but a paper with a noticeable curl due to the coating.
Also seen it on Photo Satins."

I asked him if he could tell me if there was printer to printer variation (eg we have people here who have printers that are working well, while mine and Andre's have produced nothing good). He said that once they found a paper that is susceptible to the problem they can reproduce it on all printers (I didn't ask how many they have).

I mentioned that I had seen the problem more easily on images with heavy ink loading and he agreed that this would change the paper curl characteristics and make it more likely to happen.

I had meant to take a few photos of the 1st image I printer and post them last night just to keep all the info in one place. I should get a chance to do that tonight.

Here's a link to the page for HP support for designjets, click on Support Forums.
At one time I found a different forum or discussion group just for the 3100, and one guy (Tim) had posted a message indicating he had a stripe problem. I can't find my way back to that page now althogh I posted a reply to it myself.

http://h20000.www2.hp.com/bizsupport/TechS...0&lang=en&cc=us

Try this link to HP Z3100 Support and look down under the "Forums" heading. This may be where you were.

http://h41186.www4.hp.com/country/us/en/su...?pageseq=831457

Jim Cole

Yes!
This is it, thanks Jim. Tim Gray had mentioned this problem, but he posted under the hardware section not print quality. I followed his post with a Me Too post. That forum is getting practically no action though. I posted a link to this string in case he or others are still reading it.

I exchanged an email with Michael Reichmann, asking if he could make inquiries with some engineering contacts he may have made when he visited HP in Barcelona, but he replied and told me that he will soon be on the road for a month and due to time pressures could not help. In any case it's good to have his forum to discuss the problem.

Today however I got a call from the HP account manager for Charrette (who supplied my printer). He told me that he expects HP to stand by their product and fix it. I later got an email from him to let me know that he has set up a call for tomorrow with a representative from HP Engineering in Barcelona. I'm trying to move the call to a time I don't have a conflict, but I hope either tomorrow or Friday I'll be able to relay the information I get.

This is the 2nd print out of the z3100, it shows the whole image and you can see 5 columns of the zebra stripes. 20x30 on HM FAP with ICC profile made using Photo Semiglass as the paper type.
Ignore the damage that might just be visible 1/3 of the way up on the left, an accident while it was lying on the floor.

A crop from the right bottom corner of the 1st print, the leading edge. Looks great to start! 20x30 on HM FAP using Photo semiglass > 250gsm as the paper type when I profiled.

A centre crop. The larger trunk just right of middle has some vertical dotted bands. Not too clear in this image I'm afraid. The gresy are getting bland.

Lastly, the left corner. No banding, but the greys have gone completely flat.

My sympathies. That has got to be frustrating.

If you print the shot of the trees, does the banding and loss of black replicate exactly the same in each print?

I know it's tough for you, but I'm hoping that this problem is confined to a few defective printers that could be solved with a replacement printer and not a problem with all the z3100's.

It would be nice if someone from HP could chime in on this problem.

Hi Roscolo,
I had thought about making some more test prints using my original profile but decided not to bother. For one thing the problem happened in the 2nd 1/2 of the print, and it seemed to me that if this was part of the problem then I would have to make a number of additional prints. I didn't feel like spending the money to be honest.

If it's limited to a small number of printers then at least I have the solace that bad ones exist in the tech support area here in the US, so they can be a testbed for any fixes that HP design, should I decide to keep the printer.

HP have pushed out the call to Tuesday as we cannot get together given the 6 hr difference and our mutual calendars. I'm not a pro photogrpaher so my real job has to come 1st ....occasionally

Mike,
I have seen colors go flat before on other inkjet printers, just like your samples show, and it was usally associated with a bad paper profile or a clogger head.

[quote=chris anderson,Jan 24 2007, 06:32 PM]

mike,

I also agree with the clogged head. Could be a bad black or grey cartridge as well. See if the place that sold it to you will give you some new cartidges to try.

Does it have a test print mode to see what colors are printing well and what aren't?

That fact that it changes from print to print makes me think it's not the profile. Those are consistent usually.

I also agree with the clogged head. Could be a bad black or grey cartridge as well. See if the place that sold it to you will give you some new cartidges to try.

Does it have a test print mode to see what colors are printing well and what aren't?

That fact that it changes from print to print makes me think it's not the profile. Those are consistent usually.


It can also be the LUT for the calibration associated to the media.

I could tell you in a second if it's not in the raw calibration , yet if the print of the profiling chart is whacked with lack of black in the shadows (overprinting darks) then it is the cal.

I doubt it is a cartridge and pretend to think it would be the Mid grey or Black print head.

And yes this is a problem that you shouldn't spend YOUR money on fixing.

Good news, I haven't seen this problem yet on any other Z printer yet. Also if it is a print head it would do this. If you could send me the profile for the media or just do your own soft proofing you should be able to see if it is in the profile.

Ok, Now which ink is the printer using if calibrated to Fine Art Paper >250 ? I think it is Matt black, so that the colors are not right is normal. Ok it doesn't explain why the first half of the print is fine :-P, but sometimes there are some really strange things going on.

I also know and understand that you don't want to do any more prints in wasting money. Just the question I asked aboth.

Did you try to change the thickness in the papersetting ? I mean if you profile to Semi or glossy than automaticly the program chosses "normal". Now You can edit these settings and change it to "thick". I just don't understand, why there are no strips in the first one and some in your second one. I mean I REALLY DON'T believe that a little bit more ink lay down will change the shape of a paper like HM FAP. So if the shape is the same between first and second print.. why is there the diffrence in stripes ? I really would wish I had some FAP to test it myself, but as you said. I don't want to waste any money on Paper I will never use again.

EDIT: Was the print from a sheet or roll ?

Thanks for the responses guys. To be honest after that 1st print I didn't focus on the issue I saw on the foliage picture as the zebra stripes were so evident on the 2nd and all subsequent images. After I printed the 1st picture though, realising that I had chosen the wrong paper type, I simply recalibrated and created a new profile using the Photo Semigloss paper setting. In both the cal and profile patterna I didn't see anything that suggested either head or ink cartridge problems. I've also done an alignment check and a paper feed check and those patterns look good as well, with very fine lines showing no signs of drop out. On the prints and test print sections I've made since the 1st one I've not seen the flat grey issue come back with the correct profile, but I've not reprinted that image.

So I suppose I'm kind of dismissing this issue for the time being until I can see the stripe problem resolved which, on my printer and apparently on the printers in the HP Tech Support area, is pretty pervasive. By the way to answer Christopher, all of these prints were made on a 24" roll of HM FAP. The only other print I made was on an Epson Premium Lustre roll (17") to determine if I may have a bad roll of FAP. I mentioned above that I got slight banding on that print, but if the heads have been hitting the paper I'm not surprised something might now be slightly out fo whack. I've not done any more alignment/calibration tests since then. For regular banding issues the troubleshooting guide that is installed with the printer software says to do a head clean, alignment check, paper feed check in that order, so I would start from there if I felt like playing some more.

I don't think I'll be doing any more tests, at least until I speak to HP Engineering next Tuesday.