Hi everyone,

I've recently purchased my first medium format digital back and wanted to share my purchasing experiences with folks, in an effort to help others going through the same process.

I have been considering a move to medium format for more than five years now, and finally decided in December, 2006 to make the move. Since then I've done extensive research into all the options that meet my needs (nature, landscape & environmental portraiture). I may start another thread to discuss the research and conclusion I've reached, but for for now I just wanted to share my buying process and experiences.

It is probably an understatement to say that I was dreading the purchase experience. I had visions of endless unpleasant meetings with smarmy used car dealers (with apologies to all upstanding used car dealers...) I had narrowed my choices to a Hasselblad CF-39MS or a Phase One P45+. As there is no perfect system, each has their pros and cons, but for a number of reasons, ultimately the Phase was slightly ahead in terms of desirability for my needs.

Once I was ready to purchase, I started by looking at posts by articulate, well-informed members for positive experiences and what dealers they had been working with. I searched a number of forums, and in each case, two names came up with consistently high regard:

Steve Hendrix @ Professional Photo Resources (Atlanta)
Chris Lawrey @ Capture Integration (also Atlanta--is there something in the water there???)

There are also a very responsive dealer in my hometown of Seattle:
Paul Slotboom @ Optechs Camera (Seattle).

In dealing with Steve, Chris and Paul, I can say that all three dealers are first class. None ever disparaged a competitor's product or tried to use FUD (fear/uncertanty/doubt) to influence my decision. All were very knowledgeable about the products and the industry in general. All also offered me very good pricing on the equipment I was looking to purchase.

I ended up purchasing my new P45+ from Paul at Optechs. With that being said, I would not hesitate for a moment to recommend any of these three dealers for a positive and supportive purchasing experience.

In addition, I'd like to call attention to Murray Elliott @ Phase One USA, Victor Naranjan @ Hasselblad USA, and Thierry Hagenauer @ Sinar for their top-notch support of their products. If you are considering purchasing any equipment that these folks sell, they are well worth getting to know. These are not you typical "sales guys". They know their stuff and love this field--and their passion shows.

Thanks, guys! You have all been absolutely teriffic!

If you have any questions, let me know and I'll try to help as best I can.

Best regards,
Brad

Congratulations Brad. I think you're really going to be happy with the P45+. Which body did you end up going with?

I also would like to know what body you plugged into.

I have the Contax 645 with a P25 and was contemplating upgrading to the P45 but
was concerned about the long term of camera support for Phase One backs?

Hi guys,

I am using my P45 loaner (as I await my +) on a Hassy 500C/M body, but have discovered that I am not enjoying the ergonomics of the V-series bodies.

A friend of mine is providing me with his Mamiya 645 AFD setup on extended loan, and Phase has graciously agreed to provide me with my P45+ in Mamiya mount.

I will be using the borrowed Mamiya system for several months at which point I hope to be able to evaluate the viability of the Hy6 platform.

Assuming it is viable, I'll move to Hy6 later this year, otherwise I'll likely stay with Mamiya.

Thanks, Mort. I'm already loving the back and the results it provides.

Larry, I'm not sure what you mean when you say you are "concerned about the long term of camera support for Phase One backs"--in general, or specifically for the Contax?

If you are referring to the Contax specifically, I have no idea. I assume they'll continue to support it for as long as it is viable as a product offering, but I have no idea how long that might be.

But if you are speaking in the general case, my experience with Phase leads me to believe that are a well-run business with good customer service, good quality control and (by all accounts) good dealer support. Based on this (not to mention the level of quality of their product) my feeling is that they'll be around for a long time to come. I probably wouldn't have gone with their product otherwise.

-Brad

This forum has been a great source of information and shared opinions. It helped me with my purchase. Thanks everyone. I am happy to share my purchase experience for anyone interested.

Recently I purchased a P45+ and Contax 645. Like many other shooters it was a painful process deciding which back and camera to use. I was flip-flopping on a daily basis.

When I started my search I was using a Canon 1ds Mark II. When I shot film I used the Fuji GX680 (great camera), before that had a Hasselblad and Sinar for almost 15 years. When I shot film I thought I would keep my cameras for the majority of my shooting career – digital arrived and things quickly changed. With digital I seem to be changing every couple of years.

I started seriously thinking about moving over to MF digital about a year ago. I began wanting the Aptus 22, but it was dificult getting any information from Leaf to find where I could handle the back here in Canada. It was disappointing to learn the Canadian dealer on their website wasn’t a dealer any longer.

I wanted to look at the eMotion 22 and 75 as well but it is not sold in Canada and while I had a brief, positive communication with a dealer in the US I felt I needed to see, touch and test the back before purchasing. So, after a process of elimination I was left with Hasselblad and Phase – both systems widely available in North America.

I looked closely at the Hasselblad H3D-39 and came close to buying it but ultimately decided on the Phase. I have no doubt the H3D-39 is a great camera, capable of producing stunning images. A major factor why I chose Phase over Hasselblad was the Hasselblad back (on the H3D-39) needs to be tethered when using a view camera. I have an Alpa on my wish list and I shoot almost exclusively untethered so this was a big negative for me. Also, if I wanted to use another program to process my RAW files I would need to go through Flexcolor to export a DNG. This was a step I could do without in my workflow.

I briefly considered the P30 but the need for WA and the reduced crop didn’t work for me.

I was impressed with the Mamiya 645AFD II but couldn’t forget the Contax with its nice Zeiss lenses. The fact I was buying used instead of new wasn’t a big deal. Sure it’s preferable to buy new but the gear I bought looks and feels new anyway. I bought my Contax stuff over the last few months during a “Contax 645 feeding frenzy” on eBay. The prices shot up and I paid more for items selling for less around the New Year. Still, I paid about $6,000.00 USD for a camera, 3 lenses, hoods, battery holder, and a couple of other accessories – not bad. I still have to buy more but it’s a good start.

The fact that it is not built anymore was a concern… okay, to be honest a big concern. But I got over that quickly. There is lots of product still available and will be for years to come. There are also many reputable repair technicians out there if needed. Plus, the body is relatively cheap so you can pick up a spare body and use it for spare parts.

A constant mantra during my buying process was reminding myself I wasn’t buying gear that would last a career but a few years – meaning I wasn’t making a lifetime decision but a decision that works now and into the near future. It’s amazing how the pressure and stress decreases when you look at the purchase in this mind set. I have no worries about using the Contax. It works, it’s solid, plenty of gear around and lots of happy users. I also have no worries about Phase not supporting the camera. There are so many users out there I am sure a Contax back will be supported in the next upgrade. They would be ignoring a huge portion of the MF digital market if they didn’t. In any case, I am set for the next few years and if Phase doesn’t come out with a Contax mount for their next new model it won’t stop me from shooting with what I have. And just in case, I have a year to freely change my back to another camera mount. After the Hy6 has been out for bit and if Phase comes out with a back I am sure I’ll have a look – but really the system I now have does it all.

Regards,
Clive

I have no complaints with the Contax and Phase Back. Outstanding resolution.
Not sure how better it could get but would love to find out.

As stated before about Phase doubts is:

It appears that the latest and future systems are pretty much closed to the particular camera system.

If the trend continues I would think that (unless Phase puts together a deal with a mf system or makes their own) there will be few, if any, mf systems that will allow third party vendors (including Phase One) to make their backs to fit their body.

I am sure that Phase One is astute and has plans but this is a gut wrenching, as Clive said he went through, decision.

I have thoughts on selling all my mf stuff (especially when I see the outragious high prices on Ebay for the used Contax equipment) and sticking with the Canon system waiting for the IDS Mark III

But then again the great results that I see in my work can easily keep me hanging in there

This is incorrect.

You can use the H3D back on a view camera untethered using the image bank to power the back.

Nick-T

Clive,

Congratulations on your purchase as well!

It is amazing how similar our experiences were. It took me six months of research to figure out my way through the maze of options, and it sounds like we came to exactly the same conclusions.



I am also in the same boat with the H3D--I plan to use it eventually on an Arca-Swiss F 6x9 view camera. (Even though it will work with a couple thousand dollar external battery powered hard disk, that's not very cost effective from my point of view.)

I also love the Contax line as well (as well as the Zeiss glass). If they were still in business, I have little doubt that that is what I would have as well. But I think you are absolutely correct--they are fantastic and will remain useable, fixable and available for many years to come.

--

Hi, Larry,

I was much more worried about the "closed-ness" of these systems a few months ago, but I think the opportunity available to the open system maker will lead to many choices for the forseeable future. Here's what I mean:

Hassy H3D:
* Camera - Closed [Requires H3D back]
* Back - Open (with limitations) [Can be used on other cameras, but requires tethering/ImageBank for power]

F&H/Sinar/Jenoptik/Leaf Hy6/AFi:
* Camera - Open? (stated, but as yet unproven)
* Back - Open
Given that this platform hasn't shipped yet, I'm willing to give these folks the benefit of the doubt. It will be interesting to look back in a year, I think.

Mamiya ZD-22:
* Camera - Open
* Back - Closed

Phase One:
* Camera - n/a
* Back - Open

Hassy V/Contax:
* Camera - Open
* Back - N/A

My point here is that "closed" to some manufacturers means to lock down the camera to a particular MFDB, yet to others it means lock a MFDB to a particular camera. There is still at least one player without a camera affiliation, but even if that changes, it's hard to see how closing their line of backs to just that camera would be in their best interests.

That being said, there are advantages to "kits"--even if they're closed kits--convenience, reliability (or at least the promise of it), etc., so I think closed systems of one form or another are here to stay. Nevertheless, in the end, I really do think we will retain quite a bit of choice in terms of open cameras and open backs going forward--I wouldn't jump ship to Canon just yet...

Kind regards,
Brad

Yes, you are correct. I hear the image bank is very popular. But unless you purchase the image bank you can't shoot untethered. Correct me if I am wrong, but you still have to deal with connecting a cable to the back. I am sure it is much more portable but for me I didn't want any cables in the way.

Regards,
Clive

Of course these Sinar backs are open. They are the same backs that are already being used on all the main camera platforms, with the relevant adapters. When the Hy6 is released, the Sinar Hy6 adapter will be released alongside it.

Yes, this is true (cut and paste error). I've edited my post.

Thanks, good catch.
Brad

sounds like the zd is semi open system, alpa will be making a adaptor plate. i figure if the alpa solution exists, i guess veiw cameras will work as well.

paul