I wonder if someone could modify theHasselblad HDC 28 for use on the H1 and H2. There are really creative people out there, for example the guy, who modifies Zeiss Contax N Lenses for fully compatible AF use on Canon EOS-Bodies (www.conrus or so?). The H Cameras are great, but when you don`t want a Kodak-Chip, you are limited to 35mm and that might be a bit tight in some cases.

Have you thought about a miniture view camera such as the cambo DSII. No auto-focus, but wide lenses out to 24mm and movements too!

The idea isn`t bad, because I could also do an architecture job with such a camera.

But I´m used to the 45 on my Pentax 67 and used it a lot. For people shots in offices, groups in buildings and for interesting perspectives with music bands. I woulnd´t want to miss a real wide angle when I buy into a MF system.

I visited two friends of mine who have an analoge Mamiya 645 AF. I found the system interesting for me, because it is open and has an 28mm, too. But they said they have focussing problems with it because of the bright modern focussing screen. The both of them had lots of pictures slightly out of focus which never appeared with the old Hasselblad V they had before. Indeed whilst trying it, I also had problems finding the focus point. I will of course go to my camera store and try an AFDII to see, if the never models have better screens. But I had a Hasselblad H3D in my hands and even if the design of it´s focussing screen looked strange, I had the impression you could determine the focus point exactly. Expecting a H1 and H2 to have the same finder quality that`s why I´m interested in the H system and why I´m disappointed about the Hasselblad politics.

What`s the technical reason why a 28mm HDC won`t work on a H1/H2? Can I mount it, or will it not even fit the camera body? If you can mount it, will the camera software not recognize it? Is this a big problem for a skilled technician?

From my understanding the issue is that the lens is not chipped for the H1/H2 so it is all based on electronics and will mount on the H1/H2. While I suspect there is a way to get around this issue at least to allow for manual focus (although I am guessing here), the optically corrections that are made by the H3D with this lens will be lost. You will loose some of the optical advantages this lens has with the H3D system.

I am just hoping that when and if Hasselblad releases some T/S options, it is not restricted to the H3D.

There is actually another screen that works like the dslr before AF with a circle split in half I don't know the english name but you know what I mean.
BTW there is an assistance for the focus so it wouldn't be a problem

Optical corrections can be applied in other software as well. There are rumors that phase will impliment optical corrections for the Mamiya 28mm in their C1 software. Why not for the Hasselblad 28mm later? And there are solutions like DXO and Acolens.



Maybe a T/S will come with the H4D and is not compatible with the H3D. When you want to use it, you have to upgrade? Nice idea for constantly selling the newest products. Introduce a must have lens with each new camera body. Not downwards compatible, of course!

Any focusing support, AF or a split something screen in the center is not a real help. For a while I only used the center AF-field for focussing with a DSLR and had constant backfocuses, almost none with telephoto-lenses but with every stronger wideangle. One day I found this interesting website:

http://visual-vacations.com/Photography/fo...mpose_sucks.htm

Since then, I activate the AF-field that is close to my desired focus point. My results have become dramatically better. That´s the reason why I wouldn`t rely on a center only AF like they are used in medium format cameras. I need a good screen for manual focussing. My Pentax 67 and 67II have wonderful screens. No problems with the 45, 55 and 75 wideangles.

I have to admit I´m shooting aperture wide open most of the time.

If you want to see some examples:

www.bernd-bodtlaender.de

To be honest Bernd I don't have a problem with the center AF focus, even with recomposing the results are still sharp at wide open apertures.

Its true that optical corrections can be applied in other software but this would involve me using another piece of software and also buying this other piece of software.

All I do in FlexColor is tick a box and I can correct for distortion, chromatic abberation and vignetting. This is based on meta data from the lens which I guess other software couldn't read.

Embrace the integration of the H2/3D Bernd - its not such a bad thing!

Jo S.x

Mamiya makes a "Type C" screen designed for use in focusing with the manual focus lenses on the 645 AF, AFD and AFD II. It is not quite as bright but has a better ground glass and includes a micro-prism circle. I prefer this wth all of the lenses except under very dark situations.

Sounds good! That´s a good hint!

Do the 645AFD and 645AFDII have other (better) standart screens than the original 645AF?

Bernd

Has anyone heard anything about the plans for H T&S lenses? I had an H1 for a while before moving back to the V system, mainly for the tilt and shift functionality of the Hasselblad Flexbody, where it's a useful alternative to a view camera for cramped architectural interiors.

When the H system was released Hasselblad stated that T&S lenses were something they were looking at, but I never heard anything more about their plans.

The problen is exacabated by the high res and low DOF in MF equipment

This is exactly why I have always considered center point almot AF useless !


And therefore been an exponent of the H1/2/3 with its bright (if barrelled) view even though the_hassy_system_sucks if you own a non hassy back !

incedentally on topic..

I have never actually heard a 28mm owner say what sort of errors occur if you just stick that lens on an h1/2 and press the button

I am sure the barrelling could be sorted in software

S

I have the H3D39 system and the 28mm lens. I did mount the lens on a friend's H2 system (but he uses P45+) and the H2's shutter just won't work when the 28mm lens is mounted on. So is my H3D39 back won't work with the H2 (obviously without the power supply) but even tethered the camera just won't work. The 28mm lens is OK for such wide angle lens, but it is not superior than the 35mm or 50mm, except it is wider. Even without the DAC the lens is OK with little distortion and visible chromatic issues. But the lens is just OK, it does not have a strong character, just a superwide, reasonable sharp and good corrected lens. The 28mm is visibly behind the Schneider Digitar 24mm I have for my Alpa, and I will asume it is behind the HR 28mm from Rodenstock.

TA

This is the first ever confirmation I have read from a user !

I guess Ill have to mug up on stitching two shots from the 35 if a client ever wants superwide

I wonder waht the best solution is for rotating this lens around its nodal point

S

You could try this Morgan...

http://www.reallyrightstuff.com/rrs/Custom...%2D87%2DPkg&eq=


Still, never had a focus issue with recomposing on center AF with the H2D.

Maybe the focus calibration of Phase Backs is a bit out?


Jo S.x

Not that the HCD 28mm is not a good lens, it is OK, or may be as good as the reflex medium format lens can be, compact and focus quite quickly, but it is just not stand out (except its super wide angle) as many come to expect, or at least I expect. For single shot, perhaps it is the only solution for the SLR type capture. For extreme quality, I don't suppose it is a strong alternative than cameras capable of using those HR or Digitar lenses. Or, stitched panoramic will be a even better solution.

That´s what I thought: all that "for your comfort only" talk from Hasselblad is not honest. The truth seems to be marketing reasons. Sell their own backs instead of those of competitors. But this has nothing to do with competition. If they believed in the quality of their backs, they would let the photographers make the decision.

Stitching two shots from the 35mm lens is not an alternative for someone who shoots people. If I decide for a camera system, I want a strong wideangle in my collection, like I have it with my pentax 67 now. And the 35mm (like I have it for my Pentax 645) is not such a strong wide with a 48x36mm sensor. 28mm is something essential for a digital medium format SLR.

So is it possible to get the shutter of a H2 to work with a 28mm? There might be two possibilities: a pirate firmware-update for the camera. Maybe not such a good idea for a camera that frequently locks up even with the most actual original firmware. Second: chip the 28 like a 35. Make the camera believe it deals with a 35mm? Is that a business for a creative camera technician? How much would we pay for such a modification (if it was working reliably)? 500 USD?

With the new flexcolor 4.7 Hasselblad add one more digital correction : vignette but frankly I see little need (some might disagree) for that since the range of lenses from what I have and tried, they are pretty good in this regard, at least for single shot. I suppose the vignette correction has more to do when you need to stitch multiple captures. Anyway, from what I can tell on my shoot with the HCD 28mm, the lens is pretty well corrected, and although you can see the difference of distortion correction, it is hard to tell the difference unless you put the before and after image together. One may find the image before correction is acceptabe. And for this reason, I am pretty convinced that the 28mm can be used on H1/H2 cameras with acceptable results, and Hasselblad decided (at least for now) not to support it is base on the argument that the lens was designed with the digital correction function in mind and software and they want the result to be optimized, and also for marketing reason - because they are the only one with such focal length in the market and they can force more consumers to buy the system just for this extra lenses.
I also use Contax 645 and P45 and for such old system, the Contax line of lenses held up well against the HC/HCD lenses.
For wide angle or architecture shoot, I think there is really not much choice, that the Digitar and HR lenses are still the clear winner for really serious works. I am not so sure if the coming Hy6 will change this but with their close relationship with Schneider Optics the Hy6 may be an interesting system to see how it developed.

The Hy6 people havnt even got a 35 together yet

They must be facing huge challenges in clearing the 66 mirror and trying to cover the FF area.

The lense wil need to be at least 15mm 'more retrofocal' because of the square format

I wouldnt hold breath for a HY6 28

A mirror less camera like alpa would be OK if focusable

I think live view should have some sort of focus confirmation even fed back onto the rangefinder viewer of a alpa style camera

if this was matched with the HY6 in a seamless package ..

S

Which hasselblad camera do YOU have?
The three H bodies that I have here are rock solid since the last few firmware updates. Earlier cameras did freeze/hang but this is old news.

Nick-T

I have a 500C, a 500 ELX, 2 Pentax 67, 2 Pentax 67II, 2 Pentax 645 and a Mamiya RZ with altogehter 20 lenses. Digital only a 5D with 6 lenses. I´m trying to evaluate what a suitable medium format camera system for digital work for me was. A magazine editor recently told me after a job they still accept film, but I was a fossil.

There are lots of newer posts in this forum claiming that the H cameras hang up at least once a day. Excuse me, when I take this into my consideration. Many of my photographs have been taken in a shooting with less than an hour time. My Pentax 67 and 67II, used for 90% of my photos, never left me alone.

Which H bodies do you have? Would you recommend a H1?

I really wish people would stop talking about things they do not have personal experience with.

Many do not even own a H1/H2 and they just spread rumors about hang ups.

These hangups are long gone if you have updated the firmware.

My H2 has never failed and it is a H1 upgraded to a H2.

Good to hear that!

And how do you feel beeing excluded from using the 28mm with your H2?

I am pissed by that.
And I think Hasselblad sucks when they try to force us to buy their
backs by making lenses that cannot be used by us H1/H2 users.

I also think they suck when they are excluding us H1/H2 users from their
Masters series.


Besides the politics, I find the camera to be very good.
And far better than Mamyia 645.
I have had a few of those and they are not an option for me anymore.

Contax, with a faster sync, would have been an option.

I am that conurus guy and I got an email from you asking me to look into it.

I certainly recognize this as a problem both important and interesting. My apologies to disappoint all of you but please do not hold your hopes too high. We are not a big company by any measure, but we do not have the money to invest in a H3D and a 28mm for investigation. If there is a venture capitalist among you who thinks this is worthwhile investment, we may be able to work something out. I would be more interested in adapting H3 lenses to Contax 645 actually, since I already know the Contax protocols.

I think your participation is appreciated a lot.

I hope this forum brings together the right people to move something.

The point I am trying to make is that one of those newer posts:



...was made by yourself and you do not own a camera yet are happy to perpetuate the myth.

I have an H1 and H2 and an H3D.
If you are using a non Hasselblad back then the only gain with the H2 over the H1 is the better battery that comes with the upgrade. (Last time I looked the upgrade H1>H2 was cheaper than buying a 7.2V battery and charger).

Oh and I love my 28mm btw and the corrections are fantastic.

Nick-T

Here here.

Its tiring to hear about H1/H2 hangups when it simply isn't true.

The lens corrections are fantastic, agreed.

Jo S.x

Hi Frode,
Which Mamiya 645 were you talking about? I'm always interested in comparisons from photographers who have had both. Was it the body, or the lenses or both?

Thanks
Jon

This may be off topic, but have any of you updated your H1/H2 firmware by downloading Flexcolor and using a Hasselblad back from your local dealer? This avoids having to send the cameras back to Hasselblad. I know this can be done, but are there problems or hang-ups I need to be aware of? Is the current firmware update worth doing this?

Sorry to hear that. My H2 is 100% stable. Never had a problem...

Yep do it all the time, follow the instructions carefully and you will be fine..

Nick-T

I've had both H1, AFdII and now use H2.
I agree the H2 is a superior camera. Full of usable functions, profiles, very fast AF, very bright viewfinder, and the battery consumption is impressive, very low also.

Thanks Samuel,

What let the AFD2 down, compared with the H2, or is it all you listed above?
Jon

To be honest, the only reason I left the AFDII was that the DB never arrived. I was waiting two months for the P21 in Mamiya mount but i wasn't avaible. They told me if I buy the Hasselblad the P21 arrives in one week. I needed it for a project that must be finished at the end of november so I went for it. I had a H1 before so I knew what it was and that it would work. No learning curve needed... My concerns about the H2 were price of the H system and that I didn't know how long hasselblad would take to discontinue it. I knew It was kind of a dead system too, like my contax 645. But I bought it at 1/3 of the price because of the p21.
Now I'm reading in another post that the H2 is discontinued from today and it kind of hurt. First no HC28mm and now they take down their open system option. I fell like regretting it actually....
Hasselblad's strategy sucks really but I keep thinking the H2 is a superior camera than the Mamiya.

I think the AFD is a good camera (I have one). Only the finder sucks (even with the manual focus screen). And the finder is one of the most important criteria for me. I´ll get my H1 in a week or so and then decide which system is better for my work.

I believe the rumors that leaf (or generally Dalsa sensors) has the best skin tone rendition. That´s why I´d like to buy a leaf back for the H1. Maybe I should try a H3D and see what they are capable on skin tones.

I know that feeling. I had a P45 coming from Capture integration, and the courier company have lost it (they say they are trying to find it again!) This is bad, since there seem to be plenty of Hasselblad fit P backs around, but few Mamiya.

I feel your pain about the discontinuation issues, but lets face it: either of the two systems will do the job well. I felt the choice was 50/50, and went for the Mamiya, since the lenses seemed to be 'nearly as good' as hasselblad, but a lot less expensive second hand. Also seemed to be a wide range of lenses available. Need a back, 'cos I have about 12 lenses (including a fair bit of duplication) and I want to narrow that down and sell the rest, when I've thoroughly tested them.

@ Bernd.

I'm looking forward to your comparison of the two systems. the 645 has that Achilles heel of no decent finder. I hope I can live with that!

If you're going to spend 30,000+/- on something, doesn't it make sense to test it, and the competition, out rather than just believing the "rumors"?

I bought the two bodies with a standart lens and a film back to compare the handling of the cameras. The next decission would be a digital back. And yes, indeed, it would make sense to rent something before buying it.

But let´s have a look at the prices: a Valeo 22 costs maybe 6000,- EUR, a refurb Aptus 22 or P25 cost 10.000,- EUR and a H3D22 (not available as a refurb) costs 17.000,- EUR.

Hi
It is now official as of yesterday that Mamiya is the only open platform on the market. I switched from a Hasselblad V system 8 years ago. I own a ZD camera plus 2 645 bodies (AFD & AFDII ). When I am shooting in the studio I normally rent the Aptus 22 back. It is the only system that allows a Sinar,Leaf, Phase & there own ZD back to be used with the 28mm. I think with the recent Hasselblad news that Phase is going to have to work together with Mamiya closer.

I wish that Mamiya would just release leaf shutter lenses for its 645AF system. How about licensing that aborted Contax 645AF Mark 2 design and those Carl Zeiss lenses for manufacture? That will be the day

Why not just try my special portrait Phase profiles ? They considerably improve skin tone according to some photographers on this forum.

Edmund

I tried it with my 5D and found my own profile created in C1pro to my needs better for my purpose.

I wasn't recommending the 5D profile, but the Phase profiles.

There is something really strange going on with the 5D, I have made several and they don't have much success. I have the impression that camera to camera variation is strong and that indeed users would be better served by custom profiles or edited profiles they create themselves.

The Phase profiles seem to work decently, and my old Leica profiles also made people happy.

Frankly, I'm happy when my profiles make people happy, and as they are tipware nobody can claim that I cheated them.

Edmund