Eager to try and see...
Especially this Focus Area Locator Mask - sounds really helping

Quickly tried on my MacBook Pro 2.8G with 4GB RAM, process the file I took last week with P65+, regardless of how many new features added, it is not as stable as the last one at least what I am using it, the software accidentally quit several times. I am not sure if it is the most robust version yet, although I am also certain Phase One will address it quickly. I have yet install the new verison on my station yet, just quickly try on the MacBook pro.

Make sure you uninstall the previous versions before updating. I had some crashes until I ran my uninstall app but stable since.

yes, clean reinstall is recommended. However I'd keep the V4 app (just rename it to Capture One V4...) but of course delete all preference and *.cop files as well. Settings for NR, sharpening etc. should work fine however I'd recreate them as well as the keyboard shortcuts and especially the workspaces.

If someone really, really feels like it, I need to be spoon fed this type of thing... Exactly what files at what harddrive paths need to be deleted?

http://www.captureintegration.com/2008/11/...e-one-4-on-mac/

Thank you.

any windows users out there found it installs cleanly?
need to uninstall 4.8 too?

waiting for confirmation that its stable before I move ahead.

Does anybody know if C-1 5.0 is "free" to us Phase One back users as usual in DB mode and if so are there any limitations as to the number of images that can be batched or any other limitations when using it in the DB mode?
I use just my P30 for the last 7-8 months and jobs with the canon are usually for clients/catalogue that I just give them the raws.
I have not been converting any Cr2 files in a while and mainly shoot tethered in studio to C-1 4.8.2, never went to 4.8.3 as 4.8.2 works fine for me.

I guess Doug may pop in here an answer my question hopefully if no one else does.

Thanks for any further information
and maybe people could start posting new features and wether they are good or working properly or not...:+]

Snook

Yes, I beleived so. I use it on the DB activation and works fine.

It is free in DB mode. Only limitation is that it doesn't support DSLR images and product registration doesn't work either (update notifications on DB firmware upgrades etc).

Thank Khun..
I noticed you said it was buggy/crashed, but did you un-install everything like they said to do?
Thanks for your information..

Snook

As usual, we are not recommending that anyone install this DAY ONE release on a critical computer or use for any critical job.

We have been working with the beta version up until now and are not prepared to advocate the release yet for prime time. We begin testing the new release starting today and will post our findings and recommendations soon.

But yes, there are some nice new features in there. The dust brush seems to work great, being able to have a small floating focus check window again is nice - especially being able to have multiple focus check windows, etc, etc.

It's good stuff, but be careful.


Steve Hendrix

Hopefully they make the web contact sheet have the flagged and or star rating as well as the file name.. this completely stinks they did not make it like that in the beginning....
Hope they are reading these threads and make it an option in 5.1 which I doubt but am crossing my fingers.. Making contact sheets fro low jpegs fro the clients to quickly see is awesome but not when the ratings are not a long side the file name!!!!
Only option I can think of is making a seperate contact sheet with the flagged images only but this slows down the process...
LOVING it if the focus tool works properly!!!!!! that only is a MAJOR upgrade! specially for us manual RZ focusers...:+]

Snook

sorry internet problem double post...

`sorry double post

that was my impression with the Beta as well however in the final release it doesn't work at all. Support told me it was removed (though the actual tool is present) due to some problems.

Too, I can't import LCC files from other sessions... actually I use them all the time for LCC based lens corrections even for the MF camera.
This is not so...... but, yes, the things that work are a huge step forward.

They still have not added the "stitching tool" I have a feeling they are not going to either. I have one client I really need to use the flex adapter with. Supposedly there is a work around which will probably involve layers in photoshop.
I may have to keep using multiple versions of Capture one indefinitely. There must not be many of us who ever use that feature. I was really hoping they would finally put it in so I could do everything in the one software.

I use stitching quite often. But compared to the C1 V3 stitcher Photoshops merger is so much better and faster. So I don't really miss the stitcher, especially as the new LCC based light falloff makes things much easier. However a good stitcher would certainly be very nice.

as to the dust removal... it is working. There is just no "spot" removal. Sorry for the confusion.

I'll be commenting a lot more later this week (very busy time for us right now), but FYI there is a "stitch in photoshop" script in C15. Select the frames to be stitched and go to the scripts menu (icon to the right of "help") and select Bundled Scripts - Stitch in Photoshop. It's very powerful and fast. Not as fast as the version 3 stitch tool but it's a huge leap forward from what was possible in version 4.

Doug

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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not really powerful as the merging mode selected in the script is one that may deform the captures sometimes. I actually prefer the "reposition only" mode. Too, I prefer that the layers stay separated in the first step to check the stitching... sometimes there are little errors and you may not discover them immediately if you don't know were the stichting line goes through the image.

Has anyone tried moving a session from v5 to v4? Any problems with this? If v5 fails, it'd be nice to be able to just fire up v4.

Anyone compare processing times on a multi-core machine? Any chance of Grand Central optimization?

At first glance the focus mask sounded lame to me. But I gotta say it works well and quickly. I can see its potential.
Still can't select multiple folders from the Library. Bummer.
But I see some more good v3.x features being trickled back in. Excellent! This woulda been a great v4.9!

Thanks!

Version 4 sessions are converted but not overwritten, so you can go back to 4. V. 4 sessions end in .col45, v. 5 sessions end in .col50.

that isn't going to work. V4 stores it's settings in a folder named "settings45". V5 creates new folders named "settings50". Too, you can't locate a V5 session file with V4 (you can locate it but it's grayed out).
Click to view attachment

could you trick it by changing the name of the Col45 to col50...:+} On a copy of course as not to ruin it...
I am going to start fiddling around when I get home with my laptop...:+}
Snook

Not gonna work

Hi Steve

I find your post quite odd Are you saying that you do not recommend us to use version 5.0 until it's been tested properly?

/David

I think he is just saying that you shouldn't turn up to a shoot without testing it in a job like environment and/or have a planB if it starts behaving badly.

What is so odd ? I would never use a new program on a important workstation. It's the same as I would not upgrade a system, or firmware just after it came out, if I need it to earn my money.

So far I have two bugs.


First regarding LCC (the same on Mac and Windows):

There are two folders were the LCC profiles reside.
First is: session folder/capture one/settings50 ("setting")
Second is: ~/library/application support/capture one/lcc profiles ("profile")

The "profiles" show up in the pulldown menu of the LCC tool in C1. These profiles are working well all the time.
Now if I create a lot of LCC files I delete some of the "profiles" after some time as the list otherwise is simply getting much to long.
In addition C1 caches the profiles so it slows C1 down when there are too much LCC profiles.
Once I need an LCC profile I've already deleted in the "profiles" folder I can restore it form the "settings" folder of the respective session.
This is what "import" in the LCC tool is for I think - at least with V4 this was the way I was able to restore LCC files.
But in V5 when I select "import" a message shows up: "No Profiles were imported".


Second regarding Exposure Evaluation (only on Mac; on Windows it is working):

Exposure Evaluation shows the histogram of the capture corrected by the input (camera) profile and the filmcurve.
Any other adjustments are not reflected in the Exposure Evaluation - only in the histogram (which is output referred).
On V5 it is working only half way.... adjustments of "exposure", "contrast" or whatever are not reflected in the eposure evaluation first.
But once I select the exposure tool tab (the one with levels and curves) the exposure evaluation changes!
Not after any adjustment in the levels or curves - just by selecting the exposure tool tab.
(This only applies to the exposure tab - it does not happen with e.g. the color editor tool tab).
So there is something wrong - exposure evaluation should not be affected by image adjustments (other than input profile and filmcurve) and less than ever just by selecting the exposure tool tab.


Anyone else discovered the same?


Other than that I don't get what is so hard about coding shortcuts for zoom in/out.
On Windows you can set shortcuts for zooming; on Mac there are still only commands for "to fit", 100%, 200% and 400%.
Cumbersome...


Besides I really like the new tools.
Scrolling through thumnails is much faster now... similar to V3 finally.
As to the focus mask this would be an awesome feature for the firmware on the digiback. As far as I checked it it's really accurate and as you can set the sensitivity of the mask in the preferences that would be great for checking focus on the LCD in the field.

I for sure know what you mean Christopher.
Steve certainly scared me so much that I will not use it (seriously) the next couple of weeks

/David

Good!!

But do play with it.



Steve Hendrix

There is nothing surprising here. For a workstation (emphasis on the "getting work done" rather than playing/learning) I wouldn't use OSX, Windows, Office, Firefox, Photoshop, LightRoom, Capture One, or any other mission-critical application immediately after release.

We can all moan and complain that the software should always be perfect, but that's not reality from any software company and if you've ever done programming (which was my job for several years) you'd understand why.

I've been playing with C1 5 since the first beta and the 5.0 public release is a good release, but it has bugs and if you're goal is simply to get work done (rather than learn/play) than give it a couple weeks.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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Generally 5.0 is a great progress.

1. Focus Mask is super. Look how precisely it highlighted the sharp area shot with SuperRotator 45mm when I tilted it to the maximum.
Click to view attachment

However highlighted sky makes me wondering......

Focus Tool is also very handy.

2. Live Preview does work with my P30+ )))
The update rate is 1.2 FPS so it is not extremely fast in reflecting slight focusing adjustments, yet it's better than its absence.



BUT my favorite bug remains......
The color tagged pictures, when sorted in together, are listed in an unknown order, or disorder, rather than being ordered by name within the group:
Click to view attachment
I wrote about the bug here in April, I compiled a case to PO Support Department and was notified about the intention to fix it, but voila...

Also I was reading the 5.0 Manual but never understood the new Skin Tone tool. It says about a "homogenity slider" or something


During the day my Windows trial CO 5.0 crashed 3 times, but I still like the progress it has done )

I agree Focus mask being a revolutionary feature . that will get followers ...
really good idea .
I got some seldom crash , still not so bad for just released software.
Anyone tried new skin tool ?

As reliable as a Beta version.

I guess software standards have changed. Last time I checked if someone pays $400 for a software package, I think the user would expect not having constant crashes and missing or "turned off" features. I don't know what Phase is thinking when putting out software that should be beta and not an actual paid product. I guess when you sell $30-40K equipment, perspective on money doesn't mean the same thing.

I don't know if money perspective is the issue (remember, the vast majority of Capture One users pay Phase One $399 to Phase One, not $40,000). Or that there's an issue at all.

Software in general has a track record of instability and features not working as stated, particularly with new releases. Just check www.versiontracker.com, look at any new release feedback and for just about all programs, there are issues. It is simply impossible for Phase One or any company to reproduce all the variables that a computer system will throw at the software code to see how it will react. On the contrary, I think they do a pretty good job (in general) considering how different the hardware/software configurations are for all of our various desktops/laptops. If they really eliminated every possible variable that might cause disruption, it would never get released. When they release, they have come to a point where they feel they have exhausted their ability - which is limited by their environment - in assessing and eliminating any negative characters in the code.

One of the positives that came out of the extended development time going from C1 V3 to C1 V4 is that the code was completely re-written from the ground up, and the result of this is that any adjustments that need to be made can be accomplished in days or weeks, rather than months.


Steve Hendrix

I don't know if that's 100% true cause I've never had an issue with the release version of lightroom and I've run 1 and 2 on every machine imaginable.

I think Adobe is smart putting new versions of lightroom as a free beta. Then the people who want to play with it can and give feedback, so when the customer finally plops down their money, it's pretty much bug free.

That's the Adobe way, then the Phase way is to put it out, charge a fee and wait for customer feedback (beta test).

As gwtif says, Phase needs to go at least one year without receiving the Larry David Award.

Maybe the free beta test is a first step.

BC

I'm glad you had zero problems with LR but that's not representative of the entire user-base of LightRoom. LightRoom has had many bugs (especially in v1.0 and early in v2 - as you would expect); there was even a pretty bad bug in a release which had to be rolled back and reissued. Don't get me wrong, overall it's been very stable, but your lack of problems doesn't mean that there weren't plenty of them. As one very small example many medium format DNG files were rendered with hot-pink highlights for several version in a row during the v1 days..

That said Adobe is by far the best company I've experienced when it comes to minimal numbers of bugs. I can count on one hand the number of times Photoshop has crashed on me this year. However, Apple, Microsoft and everyone else in the software world regularly releases (paid and often very expensive) software packages with glaring omissions and very bad bugs.

Overall I've been very pleased by the relatively small number of bugs in version 5.0.



There were a relatively large number of users invited to be beta testers of Capture One 5 which had five beta releases.

Moreover any user can download a 30-day fully-functional free trial of Capture One 5 (as there has been on every version of Capture One). If you purchase anything which has a fully functional free trial which requires LESS effort... well, in any case any user is welcome to download and make sure it suits his/her needs before plopping down the cash for it. If it helps I'm sure we can get one of the famous "stickers" and place the word "beta" on your monitor next to the download for the free trial.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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Doug, with all due respect to you, I don't see your point. Of course it will not help the user having or not having BETA sticker.

I guess it's the discussion of how well PO present their software (and themselves) to the public. If you admit that PO could easily tag this release as BETA, then it is quite embarrasing IMHO.

(insert smiley face).

I ain't trying to argue with you phase boys, I just think it would be cool to say yea, sorry version 5 has some boners in it, rather than say oh yea, you should see how bad the other guys are.

I can't begin to understand how hard it is to write software, make a digital camera.

I can't begin to fathom the number of combinations of operating systems, computers, connections, drives, associated software.

Still I think it would be a positive step if an end user (that's what photographers are now . . . right . . . end users) went to work knowing what they use is stable and secure out of the box before the amex statement hits their desk.

Maybe that's not how it works anymore.


BC

Couldn't agree more. That's why we as a company (Capture Integration is a dealer of Phase One software) do so much hands-on testing on our own and encourage anyone to call us to ask us if they should upgrade/update/switch/install. If you buy your software through us you can be confident in this regard.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
__________________
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All right boys, this is for Doug Peterson, Steve Hendrix and Chris Lawery. I have spoken to Steve and Chris in person about some of this. No fault of there's, just the things I see that are wrong with Capture One. (I have not used V5 on my machines and won't until I hear it's right. I did play with it at PhotoPlus and had mixed feelings, but of course it was beta, and I guess still is.) Perhaps this should be its own thread. I think other users should chime in with what they experience as well. Everything listed below is up to CO v4.8.3. I'll bet money almost none of these are fixed or have any intelligent or elegant alternative.

Look, I don't shoot to make one image, I shoot plenty of frames and some jobs may require a few selects and some may require hundreds or more. I need apps that can work at my speed and not hinder me. Lightroom is pretty damn fast to work with, sure it could be better, but little irritates me as do so many things in Capture One. Adobe is really good to allowing 10 different ways of doing the same task, which allows great workarounds, efficiency and more. If CO doesn't even offer one option for a desired task then something is wrong.

And believe me, this isn't everything. This is what I can put together almost from memory in under an hour. Give me more time and I can probably get more to add here.

The very last item, the noise reduction bug seems bad to me. And it's been there for a good while.

Poor workflow (or need to add):

- Copy and apply adjustments is slow and tedious when only one or a few adjustments to copy are desired. Requires 2 clicks to check and uncheck EACH undesired adjustment (or grouping) in the clipboard. Just make it work like Lightroom, PLEASE.

- Allow a variant AND multiple other images selected so that the adjustments made to the primary variant are applied in real time to the rest. Again like Lightroom. There is a tool bar button “1” in a rectangle which does nothing clicked or not.

- Automatic Chromatic aberration correction is brilliant, BUT allow the “automatic” part to be applied to many images in a batch method, not just the resulting correction itself, for example a 17mm lens frame needs different correction from what might be the next frame at 24mm. As of now, every frame with different focal length has to be manually done to apply "automatic" CA corrections. (this is a fundamental issue with Capture One and the developers, they don't seem to understand large volume workflow at all)

- The beta of v5.0 did not allow Target Levels for each R G B channel, the target levels are very necessary. Hell, no version of 4 even had individual RGB target levels, when V3 did.

- There is a white peppering in some high ISO DSLR images. Need a slider to lessen or eliminate that look.

- I want a centralized section for seeing, selecting, creating Presets for ALL tools, not selecting a preset for one tool by clicking a tiny triangle only at that tool. This is separate from styles.

- Allow (on Mac) command + or - and command/option 0 for image sizing. Every image app imaginable does this.

- Have Batch Rename be more sophisticated. Allow the app to figure out the date of a file so a folder of images shot on different days all get named to what is one very good standard YYYYMMDD_text_(4 digit filenumber).extension and not the same date.

- On a 13” macbook screen, the sorting dropdown that is above the vertical thumbnails does not show unless the thumbnails are widened to two across or more. That causes the main image window to be too tiny. Yes, I know sorting is in the main top menu under View, but I rarely use top menus in any app. Sorting dropdown with the thumbnails is more needed than the thumbnail sizing tool. Allow some option in what to see. You get this little option if thumbnails panel is too narrow, do the same for sorting:
Click to view attachment

Moronic or lazy coding (these make me crazy):

- Customize -> Show -> Icon & Text does nothing, no text for icons in top tool bar. Version 3 was the last time this worked!

- Distortion tool ONLY corrects barrel distortion. It should have both + and - adjustment to correct pincushion as well.

- Why is a JPEG an unsupported file for doing basic lens adjustments and distortion corrections?

- Users should not have to delete almost everything related to a previous version to have a new version run smoothly. Almost all other apps allow overwriting the app or allow an app to run alongside the previous version.

- When in Crop, if a crop edge is at the edge of a tool panel, the tool panel gets pulled and not the crop edge. Have the crop take precedent!

- Far too many times, I miss the crop edge by a fraction of an inch and it causes the crop to be cancelled or makes a near 1 pixel box crop. Work on this, please. Again look to Lightroom.

- Please allow clicking on a tool title bar to expand or contract, not some tiny little triangle

Bugs:

- while a large group of images is processing, selecting a new image to adjust causes app to crash (many times this has happened, in 4.8.2 and 4.8.3 most recently as well as older versions) I have followed the Capture Integration method of upgrading to no avail with this issue. I can run a mac as well or better than some Apple store genius, it's just CO V4.8.x acting crazy.

- MAJOR bug in noise reduction for high ISO images (Canon files are what I shoot). Example, click on a high ISO image (6400 ISO image used for this example, shows it very well) for the first time, with an already created preset of 10, 10 noise reduction (my own preference). Image looks mushy. Then zero out all noise reduction, and reapply 10, 10 noise reduction, image looks completely different! This goes to show no one seems to use the app. This has been there for many versions of V4 pro. (below is exact same image, exact same settings)
Click to view attachment
Click to view attachment

solved in V5.0

MUCH improved in V5.0. More like in V3, but better and faster

I don't use the compariant variant and the "edit primary" option actually, so I don't know exactly how it works.
But in V5.0 you have a certain amount of captures selected (either way variant or not), edit the primary file, then hold shift and click on "local copy/apply".
The adjustments of the primary capture are applied to all selected files immediately. It's fast!

true. Workaround: select the brwoser by "focal length" and copy/apply the respective adjustments.
Hmh.. cumbersome, but still better than editing every single capture.

I honestly didn't get that... that is what styles is for.

yes, please, finally!!

no. Set "lens" from "generic" to "generic pincusion" and you get what you are looking for. Since 4.5 or so...

solved in V5.0 as you can set a margin either for the regular view or the new "proof margin" view.
The "proof margin" allows you - finally - to set a neutral frame around the preview.

solved in V5.0

In version 5 there is a "local" copy and apply which lets you do this in one click.





That would be nice. However, the new local copy-and-apply option in C15 accomplishes much of the same goal. It's not real time, but it is very fast and easy.





Yes, that would be nice. The CA correction routine is so great and fast/easy that it begs for a easier way to apply it to all incoming images.





I need to look into that as I don't know if that is coming back or not (it's not there in v5.0). As a side note here I'd say that only 5% of the users that I work with have ever used individual RGB target levels.





On the other hand there is significantly more detail in high ISO dSLR shots than in ACR (including the current beta of LR3) or Aperture and the look of the noise is more like a film grain than digital processing artifacts. I know the team in DK obsesses (e.g. working on holidays and in spare time) to improve the algorithms for noise vs. detail.

I have on my list of to-dos to check whether the new dedicated slider for long exposure will help high-ISO dSLR shots since that slider targets the sort of speckling you describe (which happens as well in long exposures). If anyone has already tested this I'd be curious for you to share.



I'm very confused by this. How is this different than styles? Could you describe the UI you're imagining? I think styles ROCK.





YES! I hope they do add Command+ and Command- for zoom in and out if only because I get a lot of requests for that. Personally I very rarely find myself at an arbitrary zoom level but almost always using the hand tool double-click shortcut to zoom in to 100% or zoom-to-fit, so personally I don't see the big deal, but the users have clearly indicated they want this to be added, and the users are the ones who pay the bills!

Note that the standards Command-0 (zoom to fit) and Command-Option-0 (zoom to 100%) DO in fact work and have worked since v4.



If you want such fine-grain control of file names (which I agree is a good workflow - for some specific styles of shooting) you'll always be better off with a dedicated program like Better File Renamer or Bridge for your importing/renaming. If you run Better File Renamer while Capture One is open then C1 will see that you're renaming them and maintain their image settings.

I do agree (as I'm sure the developers in DK do) that a few more options in Batch Renamer would be nice; when it was first put into version 4 a lot of users requested a continuous counter and it was added in around version 4.7, so they do listen to such requests. But I just wanted to note that it's not their goal to make C1 a does-everything program (so that they can continue to focus their resources on things such as the quality of the conversion) and so many sincerely good ideas (e.g. printing from within the program) will not come to fruition.

Sounds like you need to add the sorting methods of your choice to keyboard shortcuts so you can access them quickly. Otherwise there will of course be some user interface options that can't be fit onto a 13" screen. Or, as you say you can use the drop down menu. Allowing full customization of which options you see there would be nice, but I don't know that I'd personally want that at the top of the to-do list taking away from development time on other items.



Yes, I wish they would either remove the option, or make it work. It's small but it's annoying.




Change to "pincushion distortion" in the menu. Voila. Excellent opportunity to point out just how awesome it is to be able to be able to correct for distortion (in batches none-the-less) at this stage in your workflow.

In addition correction of both barrel and pincushion distortion is fine-tuned to each specific lens which C1 supports directly (e.g. Phase One, Hasselblad H series, Hasselblad Zeiss, Contax).




So true! To be fair, MOST users can do the upgrade without anything more than drag and drop, but you're right that the only way to be 100% sure that everything will be hunky dorey is to follow our uninstall instructions.




Done in v5. Increase the margin under preferences and every image will always end slightly before the tool panel / browser correcting this (very annoying) issue. There is also a toggle above and to the left of the image for an additional "proof margin" for the separate purpose of "previewing" the image in a more neutral environment - you can add a keyboard shortcut for this for fast access. These sorts of things will be in Capture Integration's online training in a few weeks.




Respectfully disagree. As a UI element the tool title bar is too large to trigger an expansion/contract and will lead to many users accidentally contracting tools.

I think when you delve into Capture One 5 you will see that many many of the requests from users were implemented including many asked for on this board (often directed at myself or another member of Capture Integration). I personally spent many hours emailing back and forth on feature requests based on the input of our customers and of this and other online forums and the direct result of this can be seen in Capture One 5.

The point being that we encourage you to continue to make your requests! They ARE listened to and taken very seriously.

Doug Peterson (e-mail Me)
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You rock! with helping me with some of these. Glad to see a few things are better in V5.0. When enough people say it's stable, I'll venture.

I still find the Phase mindset/programming to be quite odd and at times clueless as to how we work in and use CO.

Doug... think about print size (~32%). Or 50% for sharpening. Or 25% for the smallest highrez preview in C1 (even with the new size-slider for the previews in the preferences).
100% is for fetishists and to double check NR and sharpening, and of course for focus checking, but for the actual image (printed) 100% is not so important. Especially the commands for 200% and 400% are strange... when on the other hand +/- is missing.

Here's what bugs me. Phase and Phase dealers constantly say that many DSLR users buy CO. So make the lens corrections more useful for them. I don't need specific lens presets, but I don't want to hear how great it works with hassey lenses, phase lenses, blah, blah.

And the UI thing, ppplllleeeeaaasssseee, Lightroom spanks Phase in intelligence when it comes to clicking a tool bar to expand/contract. I hear no one complaining about that feature in LR. It's highly desired.

Again, this app is for us. We shoot. We process files. It's not for the developers or the dealers.

Good to hear some things are getting better.