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dwdallam
What would be the minimum lights I would need to do some indoor portrait type photography? What is the cost going to be, average? Also, is there such as thing as a viable portable backdrop or backdrop stand taht I can hange sheets of cloth and other backdrops from? Again, how much?

Where do you suggest I buy this equipment?
boku
QUOTE (dwdallam @ Oct. 03 2005,18:35)
What would be the minimum lights I would need to do some indoor portrait type photography? What is the cost going to be, average? Also, is there such as thing as a viable portable backdrop or backdrop stand taht I can hange sheets of cloth and other backdrops from? Again, how much?

Where do you suggest I buy this equipment?

Go to the Alien Bees website and have a look around. This is quality stuff and fair prices.

I would recommend at least 2 studio strobes for portraiture. There are some that have used only one, and the full blown setup is 4 (main, fill, hair, and background).

You may get by with the 400 WS units, but the 800 WS units aren't that much more expensive and give more power needed for distant group setup lighting.

My setup is (2) 800 WS unit and (2) 400 WS units. I have the full compliment of stands, light boxes, umbrellas, a boom, reflectors, and grids.

You need something to soften the light so umbrellas or light boxes are a must for normal portait usage.

Adorama and B&H sell a host of portable background setups. I am no expert on this, but I see they have a ton of stuff.
Hank
We buy most of our studio supplies from Calumet

Their online info is good, and it's well worth ordering one of their catalogs as a reference.  When you call, you usually find someone who really knows what they are talking about.

Lot of info on portable backgrounds there, too.  We use some "pop-up" versions, I believe from Photoflex, but usually find them too small exept for seated portraits.  We also have some nifty Bogen stands with crossbars that allow us to drape backdrops up to 20' wide, but can be used smaller with shorter crossbars.  You could even get by with several large "clothespin" style squeeze clamps from a hardware store for draping backgrounds where there is anything to clamp to.  I don't remember the name, but Calumet also has some collapsible backdrop frames made from hinged PVC pipe, which we also find useful for suspending large diffusers in front of lights or windows, or to cover with large reflectors.  They're not bad as large scrims when you want to control light spill.

As for what's the minimum light power and number, a WHOLE LOT depends upon the effect you want to create.  On location we sometimes can get by using a single light and reflector, where ambient light and backgrounds are suitable.  As Bob says, two lights is about minimum when you want to completely control the light, and four is better.  I agree that 800 w/s is about right for most uses.  We have them as small as 250 and as large as 4800, but most of our unilights and powerpack lights live their lives between 400 and 800 unless venues or sets get large.  The most-used shooting room in our studio is 14x30, and for that a 4-light set with the key light at 800 is almost overkill.
Jonathan Wienke
I have 2 AB400 and 2 AB800 Alien Bees, with stands and umbrellas and the wired remote so I can control all of the lights from one location. I use the AB800s for main and fill, and the AB400s for background and hair. I can shoot a family of 3-6 at ISO 100, f/11, 1/250 with the AB800s about 1-2 stops below full power.

dwdallam
Excellent. Thanks. Before I even go shopping, what are we looking at price wise, and could I buy used? BTW, what sort of light is it, Tungsten/Halogen?

Also, thanks for including that shot.

I didn't even think about PVC pipe and the spring clamps. That would sure be a cheap way to have a portable background. Although it would take a little more time to assemble the PVC.
boku
All of us have been discussing studio strobes.

Tungsten/Halogen lights are too hot to use for portaits.
Hank
To further illustrate the point of flexibility in lighting to create the "effect" you want, take another look at Jonathan's portrait.  

If you wanted an OOF background, you would need either a room large enough to move the background back or to use a much larger aperture while reducing the light even more.  He's already reduced the power on the 800 quite a bit, in addition to using a comparatively small aperture.

For this kind of intimate (and fun) portrait you don't need a whole lot of power, but you do need careful control of your light and your setting.  With sufficient power (as in an 800), you can work intimately by reducing power while having the reserve for much larger settings.
Jonathan Wienke
QUOTE (boku @ Oct. 04 2005,01:30)
All of us have been discussing studio strobes.

Tungsten/Halogen lights are too hot to use for portaits.

In addition to the heat issue, there is the problem of controlling the light intensity and attaching modifiers, such as softboxes and grids. Continuous light sources that allow all of these things are far more expensive than Alien Bee strobes, and if you use cheap halogen work lights, you have little control over the light output and adding modifiers poses a fire hazard. Use continuous lighting for video, and strobes for still photography.
Hank
Good points Jonathan.  In addition tungsten bulbs change color with use, which can be problematic for color balance- whether you are shooting for skin tones or "new age" colors in products.
Jonathan Wienke
In addition to the color change over time, incandescent/halogen light sources change color temperature as you adjust their intensity, further complicating color correction in post.
dwdallam
QUOTE (Jonathan Wienke @ Oct. 04 2005,10:51)
QUOTE (boku @ Oct. 04 2005,01:30)
All of us have been discussing studio strobes.

Tungsten/Halogen lights are too hot to use for portaits.

In addition to the heat issue, there is the problem of controlling the light intensity and attaching modifiers, such as softboxes and grids. Continuous light sources that allow all of these things are far more expensive than Alien Bee strobes, and if you use cheap halogen work lights, you have little control over the light output and adding modifiers poses a fire hazard. Use continuous lighting for video, and strobes for still photography.

Well, I was thinking about using a riastat (like a router control) inbetween the light and the power to throttle the halogen lights--like the ones in your dining room wiht teh dial on them, and then only turning them on when I took the picture with a remote switch. So after I got the exposure right, I'd just flip the switch, and take the picture, then flip the switch and their off.

However, like you say, using boxes and umbrellas would pose a problem, and how to set them up with work lights and things like that--blah. I see why strobes are the way to go now.

But I guess strobes are the thing to use these days.
dwdallam
QUOTE (Jonathan Wienke @ Oct. 04 2005,11:13)
In addition to the color change over time, incandescent/halogen light sources change color temperature as you adjust their intensity, further complicating color correction in post.

Yeah I see how that would work too.

I wish I had a house big enough for a 12 x 20 room jsut for photography. That would be fun, and educational since you could practice anytime.
Hank
QUOTE
I wish I had a house big enough for a 12 x 20 room jsut for photography. That would be fun, and educational since you could practice anytime.


Our first "studio" was one of the car bays of about those dimensions in a 2-car garage, and it worked surprisingly well.  Backdrops were clamped to ceiling joists with the clothespin clamps I mentioned- right in front of the car door.  Best of all, your car "reserves" space for your studio between shoots and it's a small matter to back it out when the space is needed.  You can go for hours in your garage without disrupting the rest of the household.  Ours was heated and had no windows, both pluses for studio functions.
dwdallam
QUOTE (Hank @ Oct. 05 2005,11:09)
QUOTE
I wish I had a house big enough for a 12 x 20 room jsut for photography. That would be fun, and educational since you could practice anytime.


Our first "studio" was one of the car bays of about those dimensions in a 2-car garage, and it worked surprisingly well.  Backdrops were clamped to ceiling joists with the clothespin clamps I mentioned- right in front of the car door.  Best of all, your car "reserves" space for your studio between shoots and it's a small matter to back it out when the space is needed.  You can go for hours in your garage without disrupting the rest of the household.  Ours was heated and had no windows, both pluses for studio functions.

You have a garage? I live in California. Garages put the median price of a house over 300K here. hahaha
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